Re: [HoE] Revised Edition [Shane]

[The Baron Samedi <baron11@netmcr.com>]

From the Player's Guide: 
> 
>***Changes to Player's material*** 
> 
>Trait Checks (36): Coordinations have always bugged us, so we got rid of 
>them. Sort of. They’re now called “Trait Levels,” which in itself isn’t a big 
>change, but it changes the mindset of those who are frustrated that their 
>Trait is often better than their skill, particularly when making the 
>old-style default rolls (see the change to those below). We also draw 
>attention from the controlling Trait by having you list your character’s 
>Aptitudes with the die type. It’s subtle, but it makes the game much easier 
>for new players to learn. 
> 
so, then, this means that the Coordination just got a name change and thats 
it (for this paragrph). 
This sounds fine to me.

>Default Skill Rolls (26): Along with the change to Trait checks, we made 
>default rolls diffferent so that players aren’t looking at their 1d12 search 
>and wondering why they wouldn’t want to always roll their 4d12 Deftness 
>instead, even with the old “unskilled” penalty of -8. Changing the way 
>unskilled rolls works to a single die with a -4 penalty also changes the 
>mindset of those who think it’s better to be unskilled at something and 
>suffer the modifier than to get less dice. (Statistically, it’s true in some 
>cases and not in others.)
Yet another change there. I am not surprised. We will see how this one 
works. eventually a working unskilled system will be found.
> 
>Skill Lists (38-48): These are now alphabetized instead of listed with 
>individual Traits.
ah yes...
>Throwin’ (46): Who wants a concentration for all the different things you can 
>throw? Like with Hell on Earth, we divided the concentrations up into 
>balanced and unbalanced. 
> 
um, ok...not big on that but I am sure I am in the minority
>Night Terrors (56): Everyone hated the way this Hindrance worked, and it was 
>a pain in the saddlesore to keep up with. The new night terrors works like 
>this. Make a Spirit roll at the beginning of each session or lose your lowest 
>chip. If you do lose a chip, however, your character experiences a prescient 
>dream as before. 
question: 
If you lose the chip, the way fate chips works, you should gain one for 
your flaw inhibiting you, right? if not this hindrance is different then 
all others. I don't like this as this goes against how the game works to 
me. like you said in HoE, its beautiful, if you don't play yer weaknesses, 
you don't get the chips. well my night terrors just caused me to lose my 
lowest chip. that inhibited me and if I play it I should get a chip. unless 
you change the system for that one hindrance.

> 
>Gift o’ Gab (62): Characters now get to pick up languages as if they had a 
>skill of 1 after a few minutes of conversation. This cleared up some 
>ambiguities on the old system. 
I approve.
> 
>Luck o’ the Irish (63): This Edge now give the character an extra Fate Chip 
>per session. Much simpler. 
um, OK
> 
>Knacks (Quick & the Dead): These are no longer Edges. Your character can get 
>them only by gaining a mysterious past (drawing a Joker during character 
>creation). 
I really, really, really don't like this. Knacks are often part of the 
character, and I have deliberately taken then before, esp for non-arcanes. 
I think the randomness is not bad, but dumping them as semi-edges is 
something I would be really really unhappy with. I know I won't do it. 
Its just that Knacks can play so strongly into a character concept that to 
not have them as an option seems limiting to me. I'm asking for this to be 
reconsidered.

> 
>Movement (116): In earlier editions, movement was broken up over your 
>actions. That was mainly done to figure out when a character was running or 
>not. It was clunky and made for some strange situations (characters with more 
>actions moved in small increments while slower characters raced around the 
>battle area). We changed it so that your hero can still move up to twice his 
>Pace in a round, but you can break it up however you want. Move over his Pace 
>in a single action and he gets the running penalty.
works 
> 
>Weapon Speed (118): The biggest change to combat is that we got rid of weapon 
>speeds. We originally did this so that there was a difference between single- 
>and double-action pistols. It’s a very slight difference in the real world, 
>and hard to model in a game. We started with the most realistic but it made 
>single-actions, rifles, and shotguns slow and a pain to remember the 
>“shootin’ from the hip” modifier. So we ditched all that and did this 
>instead: double-actions get to fire twice each action while single-actions 
>fire once (but can fan). Rifles and shotguns can fire once per action.
uh...um...Ok...that will take some getting used to.
> 
>Fate Chips (145): Chips can be spent on the Strength portion ofhand-to-hand 
>damage rolls. Legend chips can be used to reroll anything, including table 
>results like backlash. They’re also discarded once used! Use ‘em wisely!
don't think I like this one. makes legend chips far less useful.
> 
>Hexes (154): Hucksters have gotten a rock from the start. Not only did they 
>have to buy each hex as its own skill, they then had to make a skill roll, 
>draw cards, and risk getting their heads blown off by manitous as well. They 
>still have to do the card business, but red Jokers are always good, and all 
>their hexes now use a single skill—hexslingin’. That means they can get 
>better at their craft and have better chances to pull off their spells.
so only Harrowed, Chi Martial Artists and Voodooists have individual 
powers? that seems really off to me. Also, unlike most other changes, this 
one will be very very hard to institute. Also, red jokers always being 
good are, IMHO, a bit much. how much would individual hexes be? 5? 
should Voodooists just roll their faith or do they get gimped?
> 
>Mad Scientists (165): Red Jokers are always good and no longer cause madness. 
> 
jeez...again I don't like this.
>Rituals (182): Shamans got the same makeover that hucksters did. Their 
>various rituals are now one skill with several concentrations. 
>
so, then, the system is being changed a WHOLE LOT from before.
> 
From the Marshal's Book: 
>
>
>Fear Effects (19): We’ve made the bad guys a little more powerful and greatly 
>reduced the job of the Marshal in tracking fear effects. From now on, the 
>Marshal simply draws chips at the beginning of each fight in areas of high 
>fear (Fear Levels 4-6). 1 Chip at Fear Level 4, 2 at 5, and 3 at 6. 
> 
>Grit (22): We got rid of the whole concept of “fearmongers.” Too many folks 
>just couldn’t decide who or what a fearmonger was. From now on, award Grit 
>when your posse defeats a major evil—it’s your call if the end of any 
>adventure is worthy. Also, a character’s maximum Grit is 5, and it can now be 
>lost by going bust on a guts check made against a TN of 9 or higher. 
makes sense to me.
> 
>Fate Chips (24-25): We made sure you knew Fate Chips for solving the 
>adventure are rewarded during the adventure, not at the end of each session. 
>We also made it clear that the Marshal isn’t supposed to use Legend Chips 
>(put 'em back and draw another).
NP 
> 
>Knacks (39): As we mentioned in the Weird West Player’s Guide, Knacks are now 
>a mysterious past. If you have players who bought knacks as Edges, leave ‘em 
>alone. You can institute the change on any new characters brought into your 
>game if you want. We also gave knacks Legend Chip abilities. 
> 
see above
>Monster Powers (61): We made a set of standard monster powers as we did in 
>Deadlands: Hell on Earth. Special powers that don’t fit into these standard 
>subsets will still be listed on each individual creature profile. 
> 
makes sense
>Size Table (61): The long-awaited Size Table helps you figure out how big 
>your own varmints are. (Will post on web-site next week). 
> 
not a bad thing
>Los Diablos (71): The devil bulls come calling sometime after they’ve reached 
>5 Grit. Treat it more as a minimum than an alarm bell. When the hero becomes 
>a real thorn in the Reckoner’s side, they come calling. 
> 
right
This "Revised edition" has become a very different 2nd edition under a 
different name, IMHO. Your talking some big changes that can be really 
hard to retcon and make some past books much less useful, and indeed make 
past NPCs have nonsensical stats. I see this as a big problem. I liked 
your idea in the beginning, I like your Player and Marshal books, but some 
of this will be hard to swallow. I will send more down the pipe later.
Baron