[PyrNet-L] Flock Guardian Pyr Problem

[judith diamond <pyrenees@gwi.net>]

>
>
> Dear all,

   Firstly, can you guy's believe how close to Pyr-mas it is? Yipeeee!
Ho! Woof, woof, woof, Ho! Ho! Ho! Secondly, Happy Holidays to all you
pyr lovin' py-net pyr crazed people. Ditto to your pyrs. Anyone that
would like to actually give your pyr a cuddle for me and tell them
Judith & pyrs are sending it, well, that would be a nice X'mas present!
<vbg>

>  in someones swimming pool, more power to them.  There is a distinct
>  difference in walking up to someones front door, or trespassing the
> rest
>  of their property, and evidently a lot of you fail to distinguish the
>
>  difference.  I just bet your the type of folks who would sue, if your
> kid
>  fell in the same pool that they had no business being anywhere near.

    Now really, I doubt that that is true of any of us! I know that it
is definitely 'not' true of me.    I have had a whooping sure 'win' sue
situation, where the other party was wrong hands down and he knew it! It
was something that I could've easily had proven, some construction that
went arrogantly, purposefully and illegally left undone by a contractor.
I had photos, witness's and the proof of my  house of a lot of work that
was paid for not being done. 38 % to be precise. I, after much mind
wrangling over it, decided that it was not worth the the turmoil, it
would have inevitably caused in my life to be right or even to be
fiancially compensated for it. I also concluded that I was in some part
responsible for being a dumbo to trust this guy and to pay him in
advance. I had trusted him so well, I once let him watch my pyrs to let
them poop and go outfor the day. So, I let it die. Unfortunately, this
was 2 summers ago and we have not found or the time to fix the undone
mess. <bg>

> But
>  the owners of the pool MUST provide multiple fencing on his own
> property
>  to keep these same kids out, and in the end, will probably still be
> sued!

    Not if I have anything to do with that one, either!
    I doubt that I would successfully be sued. A week ago we just
finished a long construction project. Which, BTW, was partly why for so
long that I had no time to read or post here. I missed you all. <bg> I
was the general contractor to save us a chunk of money. I have had some
experience with these thing's before, as well. We built a pool house to
be able to swim in Maine in the winter and not have to visit you pyr
southerner's. Besides, I fall victim to New England's sun loss 6 months
of the year. I can get cabin fever. Now, with our pool, I do think that
I will be fine and not have to travel or anything else. The excersise
and the fun of excersise is what I needed.
    The pool house is completely fenced off from the outside by our pyr
fencing of an acre of land. I thought that might not be enough to
protect the mischevious neighborhood kid's or the fabulous and brave
swimmer Lexi, my pyr.Thereby, I keep it locked. In addition and mostly
to protect my families which includes my pyrs babies, liability, I am
adding an alarm system. A very loud alarm system. It maybe connected to
the house ans to the police. The intruder, will hopefully be scared
enough to get off the trespassed land that he or she is on, I will call
the police or the pyrs if their out. will lay down on them until I
return. <g> Either way, I believe that we are now more than protected
from one of those greedy, fools that may try to sue us  for their own
stupid mistake. For drowning, injury, being attacked or whatever those
kind's of people can come up with.

>
>  I don't think anyone DESERVES to fall in a pool, or be bit by a dog.

    No one, no one said that! Remember? I typed "almost deserves'. I did
so to make a point. The point has gone off into an unrealistic and
fictional zone. This was not my intent. I am sorry you are taking that
way. But, it is your choice.

>   and since there were comments about how someone could even shoot
> someone for trespassing on their property in their state, this was
> what I was
> referring to.

    *See below please.

> I was pointing out how just because someone sets foot on another's
> property
> that does not mean they are misbehaving or that they deserve to be bit
> or
> shot!!

   * I could be wrong, but, I do not remember saying or reading any of
the posted topic's on this subject, quite like that.

> Same for adults doing their jobs that involve going on another's
> property!  I was pointing out how vicious dogs (and people shooting at
> people
> that come on their property!) could hurt someone that has a decent
> reason for
> being there, too.

    We have been discussing mostly, 'fenced off property', not casual
entrance for a stranger's innocently walking to the front door or
electric meter person or the like and for a reason or not just suddenly
get bitten. Have we not? I have.

> I understand your frustration over owning a pool.

    I was not the pyr person who had formally said that I owned a pool.
Though, it just so happens that I do.    I guess who's post you are
specifically referring to and when, has almost confused me (Sometimes
that can be very easy to do.) <g>    Therefore, for clarification I need
to say, I originally made the pool analogy, because yards and pools can
be very, very dangerous places to be, with or without a fence and with
or without a dog around. Viscous or otherwise! I have seen many a lawn
or pasture not fenced off with very serious dangerous things in it, farm
equipment, tractor's with key's left inside the ignition, pitch forks,
rake's and garden tools left on the ground. Gas container's, old car's
that a child could get trapped playing in or refrigerator's. etc., etc.,
etc.

> joke!) These were extra expenses, true. Yet a pool is a dangerous
> thing and an
> attractive nuisance in that it is a kid magnet.  One should also
> consider the
> needed expenses/ hassles of making the pool safe before they consider
> getting
> a pool.  If you cannot afford them, then you cannot afford to have a
> pool, in
> my opinion!  Once a child drowns it is too late! It is worth taking
> some
> precautions and expenses to prevent that!! I must admit my mind is
> boggled
> that someone cares more about vicious dogs that bite than about
> protecting and
> preventing children drowning in their pool!

    I had not read a post like that. Which was it?

> I for one do not want this list
> being one of the lists and groups to blame when in the future IF this
> dog was
> allowed to live and it attacked another kid later!!

    After all is said here and all is done, how " this list", is viewed
by outside people is not my business. Not without very, very extenuating
circumstances, that is. It is my opinion, that anyone's  free flowing
speech that occurs anywhere and at anytime is a healthy and marvelous
freedom and perhaps a gift.
    For quite sometime I have worked on who I am and what I want to
become when I grow up. Plenty of day's, when I did not want to work on
myself. I work hard to live by and within certain guidelines codes,
values and morals, as we all probably do. I haven't always bee like
this. Many a time this way of life came hard to me, for I fought it
tooth and nail. Let me pass on to you all you pyr list friends, a little
prayer for Christmas that I strive to live by and repeat many times a
day:
    "God grant me the serenity to accept the things that I cannot
change,
      the courage to change the things that I can
      and the wisdom to know the difference."

>   And to respond to your comment

    Who's comment? It is not mine, is all that I know.

> that you "bet (we) are the type of folks
> that would sue, if (our) kid fell in the same pool that they had no
> business
> being anywhere near." .

    Gee, that's a lot potential law suit situations.

>  Some things are negligent if you do things to endanger others.
> People coming on someone else's property shouldn't be endangered
> because of
> setting foot on someone else's property,  by vicious dogs biting them
> or
> people shooting them!!

    I don't know about anyone else her, but, for me, I am always careful
and use my common sense when I need to walk onto someone else's land to
their house or otherwise, 'uninvited'. Now, I am talking about me, not
about kid's or anyone else!
    To me, without a dang good reason to do that, it is very, very rude
and I don't like it when it is done to me. I try to do things and live
the way I would like to have them done or not done to me. Of course, I
am someone that finds it inconsiderate, rude and thoughtless when anyone
who knows better, comes to my private sanctuary before calling to check
with us if that is all right. <BG>
    We do not have a moat, yet, but I would just love one!    I do not
remember anyone saying they did per say, in this content. This part is
pertinent  and about one of my post's. I said ( to be dramatic and bring
home a point,) that if my or family's life was in danger, meaning mortal
danger, I'd have a right and obligation to protect them or myself from a
trespasser and so would my pyrs.
    Meaning and implying, by their growling, bearing teeth taking that
protective stance or biting if necessary. Also, meaning that if we did
own a gun, we'd be within our moral and legal rights to protect
ourselves with a gun, a butter knife, a bop over the head with a bottle
or anything we could do in an emergency situation. You see?
     However, in the state of Maine, actually, one may only defend their
home, their family, property which includes their animals, their animals
and or the other's in it, if, someone else trespass's INSIDE their home
uninvited, such as a thief, rapist or murderer. As, I believe it should
be. Posted outside property is 'not'a license to shoot or an excuse for
violence to the person or person's entering the posted and or fenced in
area. Once again, if anyone still has all of our post's on this, I for
one have never indicated violence is deserved or warranted for a fenced
in yard or anywhere else, exceptin' to save a life.
    But, most especially, have not even touched the subject of a
non-fenced in area, until someone, I think you, asked about the
potential hazards to UPS, mail person's, wandering kid's and neighbor's
and such. My pyrs are purposely protected by me due to the placement of
our 1 acre fenced in yard. BTW, I had sturdy underground wire buried
everywhere under the fence as well. That almost cost more than the other
part, for we have land with ledge here in Maine. I did this because as
you know, it was likely down the road for me to have a little pyrenees
digger. I also did this for the "sue crazy public", in the event a child
would think it fun to dig under my fence to pat my polar bear's or see
what's on the other side. I did this, to protect my pyr babies mostly.
<G>
    We could have had a pool befor this year. But, in my book, my family
of Lee, husband, pyrs Jonah & Lexi and myself's fun, freedom, health and
protection was more important to do first. Not to mention the fact that
my 3 cat's love the security of the fencing. <g>


> I frankly get sick of people always putting down kids
> and not ever recognizing the good ones.

    I am sick of some people putting other's down without recognizing
the good ones in 'all' walks of life. Animals included!  I hear you. I,
for one have not hardly typed a word about a bad kid. I am not a parent
by gleeful choice, except for my pyrs. However, in the summertime most
of the neighborhood children come to play and do yard work with me,
Jonah and Lexi. The pyrs, oh the pyrs have tolerated all sorts of sudden
upheavals, tugs, pinches, tag games, feet on their paws, foot ball
tackles and such. They have done this with acceptance, happily, bored to
death, with dignity, carefully, kindly, with the happy go lucky pyr
spirit and as the gentle giants that they are. I am always proud of
their true pyr nature. They know these kids. If one were to come over
the fence uninvited and without my knowledge, all would be just fine and
dandy. I know this as truth because it has happened twice. Much to my
feathers being ruffled. <BG>

>  And no they did not sue!!  Would you have faulted them if
> they did sue??

    " As they say in New England," hard saying not knowing". Not knowing
the entire story that is. It sounds tragic though, 'right now'!
    Take good care,
    Judith, Jonah & Lexi
    .

>
>