Re: [PyrNet-L] Shock collars and pinch

[Bluebonnet <bluebonnet_72@yahoo.com>]

--- > The same person who would abuse a choke collar  
 can> abuse a pinch collar
> or a shock collar.   


    True, but then someone who would abuse a these
methods isn't likely to be intrested in a discussion
of various training styles either.

   Everyone is still going use
> their own method, I
> don't think that was ever in doubt,

    I hate to think that.  One of the beautiful things
about discussion is that it CAN change minds.  If we
aren't willing to change our viewpoint then why have
the discussion at all.
    I will admit that I am amazed by the results some
of you have described with purely motivational
methods. I have my doubts that it will work for every
dog, but it would be the approach of first choice for
me.  We always try positive first.  As a result of
this discussion, I may try it a little longer before
using other corrections. 
   The only the I resent is the implication that pinch
collars are for those who don't want to spend time
training, or who don't know other choices.  I spend
hours training my dogs.  I love working together with
them.  
       but the whole
> discussion started
> because of the attitude that these methods just
> really worked great.  

    I can understand a philosophical oppostion to the
methods.  They do work, however.  My first pyr came
home to me at 14 -16 weeks.  By that time he was a
mess.  I hate to admit it, but I was afraid of my own
dog.  After a few months of training including,
dominance training, lots of positive, and corrections
including pinch collar he was a dog you could live
with.  By a year old, he was an angel, everyone who
meet him commented on how sweet, and gentle he was.  

  You
> can hardly blame those who wouldn't use these items,
> for speaking their
> piece.   Everyone gets their say, no one is upset by
> your letter.  

     Of course, just don't give up to easily on
discussion.  It goes beyond just giving an opinion. 
If minds aren't willing to be changed, it is just
talking. If everyone is willing to seriously consider
the others viewpoints, then it is discussion.   Such
discussion does care the considerable risk of changing
minds, and practices.

              Brandy
> 

=====
"Bluebonnets" by Julia D. Booth
Offical Flower Song of the State of Texas
Chorus:
Bluebonnets, blue lovely Bluebonnets,
More beautiful than all the rest.
Texas chose you for her flower,
And we love you best, Bluebonnets.
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